デンマークの幸せの秘密
デンマークが世界一という番組を始めたいと思います。
こんにちは、Tatsuです。この番組は、サービスラーニングHirakuで出会ったstudy buddy、
デンマーク出身のIpsenさんと日本人のTatsuが、
日本語と英語を混ぜながら、文化や学びの楽しさについて語り合うポッドキャストです。
サービスラーニングHirakuは、英語を学びたい人と日本語を学びたい人が一緒に会話を学べる新しいスタイルの教科書。
私たちは実際にこの教科書を使って学んでいる様子をそのまま録音し、番組としてお届けしています。
お互いの文化と言葉を尊重しながら学ぶ、そんな新しい学びの形を一緒に体験してみませんか?
今回のエピソードでは、カルチャーショックのテーマで、デンマークの幸せの秘密を聞いています。
というのも、女性の自殺率のデータを見るとですね、世界ランキング、日本はですね、5位から8位に入っています。
本当に高すぎますね。一方、デンマークはですね、106位なんです。
100個の国が間に入ってしまうという違い、大きな違いは何なんでしょうね。
もう気になって気になって眠れない僕は、イプセンさんに聞いています。
一つ目のトピック、これがですね、concerns of the elderly people。
高齢者の心配事ですね。
そして二つ目は、精神的なストレスですね。
mental healthについてやってますね。
どんな仕組みがデンマークにあるのか、僕は非常に興味があってお話を聞いています。
最後の方で出てくるのですが、イプセンさんは個人的な意見として、personal opinionとしてですね、
幸せは家族から始まるとおっしゃってます。
Happiness starts with family。
この言葉の意味の深さをですね、よく考えることができると思います。
ぜひ最後まで聞いていただければと思います。
皆さんも思い悩むことなどあるかもしれませんが、
みんなで支え合って生きていけるような社会を作っていきたいですね。
それではお聞きください。
社会的ネットワークの重要性
So they can be a bit, you know, very hesitant on like, oh, we don't want too many immigrants, that sort of stuff.
But I've never experienced any of my grandparents talking about issues within like hospice.
So they look happy.
Yeah.
Okay.
Then, you know, the happiness for the worker.
I know the work environment is much better, but what is the secret of networking?
For the happiness, I know like, you know, one is the network outside of the work is very important.
Yeah, I think...
You can find like, you know, any kind of nice network event or like networking system.
I think it's mostly because Denmark is such a geographically small country that the friends that you make growing up,
they're very easy to stay in touch with.
Because even though I moved to Copenhagen to go to the university,
if I wanted to visit my friends, it was only like an hour and 15 minutes by train.
That's not too bad.
Like you can go home for the weekend ride and hang out with your buddies.
Also, country is not too big.
So that's why like you feel like you're connecting to your local people.
Like, you know, the way you grow up.
Yeah.
That's interesting.
And I think also generally a lot of people will just make friends with their coworkers.
And then, you know, you have your work and that you keep separate.
And then afterwards you might go out and just hang out.
And I think the difference is that I forgot what the term is called in Japanese.
When the boss says, hey, we should go drinking.
You can't really say no because that's how you get a promotion and all that.
But when Danish people do it, it's just because they want to go hang out and you can just say no.
I don't feel like it.
It's not a problem because work is work.
And the stuff you do outside of work is just pure social interaction.
You don't have to worry about the work side of things.
That's important.
So your professor or your boss is just friend like when you drink together.
メンタルヘルスの現状
Yeah.
I mean, even like during the work, yes, there's some kind of hierarchy, but that is very mild.
So you feel like it's more like a friend.
Yeah.
So 飲みに行きましょうとボスや先生に言われても
noと簡単に言える関係性っていうのは素敵ですね。
いいですね。
That's really different.
Yeah.
That's the point.
When you get a mental illness, how are you going to act in Denmark?
So that is one aspect we definitely can improve on.
There's currently a shortage of psychologists and the people that help you with mental illness.
So there's a very long wait time.
And also because it's become more important in recent times to,
hey, you should keep on top of your mental health.
Generally speaking, you have to schedule that yourself.
That doesn't really go through the workplace.
There are some exceptions, of course.
There are some work you have to do where the workplace will actually offer,
like we have an in-company psychologist to help you out because we know this work is.
So more and more specialist is hired by company now.
Yeah.
It's kind of trending.
How about in the high school or in the university?
So when I went to high school, we did have a counselor.
Already?
Yeah, but I didn't personally feel comfortable talking to him because he was also a teacher.
I had a physical education with him.
So it was kind of weird because there wasn't that separation of he's just the counselor person that you can talk to.
自殺率と幸福感の比較
Yeah.
Is it changing now?
Maybe.
I haven't actually looked into that.
In my university, I don't know if we had any counselor or psychologist.
I never checked.
Because I got surprised.
This is culture shock.
The ranking for suicide between country.
Japan is top 10.
Right.
Especially women is ranked at 8.
Oh, really?
So it depends on years.
So some ranking showing like number 5.
Yeah.
So female suicide is tough.
And it's showing the happiness is low in Japan, right?
Yeah.
It's so sad.
I can't imagine like someone's girlfriend, someone's mom, someone's grandma suicided.
And then it affects a lot for our society.
Yeah.
I even can cry about it.
But in Denmark, ranking is 106.
Really? We're that low?
Sweden was a little bit higher.
Oh, really?
So I think suicide ranking is really, really low.
So there's some kind of network, I assume.
They are happy and they have some kind of help to support.
Someone has mental illness or someone is sad.
Then there's always some kind of system or people can be reached.
And I think even though there might not be a system,
I think because we have the system, the safety net in place for everything else,
people grow up feeling very safe.
So they might think, hey, there's always going to be somewhere, someone there to help me.
Even though at the moment, you might have to wait six months
before you can see a psychologist, which is unacceptable.
But I think that feeling of overall safety sort of plays into that.
Why maybe people...
This is like a really important fact.
And how you guys behave as a society
is really something we should seriously learn.
So because I said today is the most important day for me
because it's a serious issue for our country.
And Denmark is doing great effort for this one.
And then I think it's a huge success about your country
and something I really respect and I want to learn.
文化と家族の重要性
So thank you for those information.
I think I mentioned in one of the earlier sessions,
or maybe that wasn't during the session,
but when I watched そして父になる,
the first five minutes where it's like
making their kid behave so appropriately
and he's lying about going camping with his dad
to impress the private school.
And then when they get home, the mom has to do all the cleaning,
all the cooking.
I was like, I thought it was so sad.
I was like, really? It's still like that?
That's so sad, yeah.
And when I thought, oh, that's so sad,
I assume most Japanese people watching this movie
aren't going to think anything of it.
It's just, yeah, that's probably fairly normal.
Yeah.
Sad because, you know, the father work like a robot, right?
And then the mom is having patient
and then do all the work at home like a slave.
Not slave, but, you know, like housekeeping person.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's hard to feel like love, you know, between those.
And then the kids need to lie to the people
like all sad things happening together, right?
Yeah, yeah.
It's not family, right?
But that kind of case is still happening, I think, yeah.
We need to change, yeah.
I think like younger generation realize about it.
Even like older.
It's not old everybody, but, you know,
I think there's a still that kind of things exist.
Because I like you really enjoyed about the movies that I suggested.
そして父になると送り人ね、この2つを楽しんでくれて。
うん、すごくよかった。
素晴らしい映画だっていうのは言ってくれて。
それはわかるけど、日本の問題点っていうのも確かに浮かび上がってて。
うん。
うん。
それをね、美しくもある表現の中で楽しんでくれたと。
うん。
それは嬉しかったです。
で、その時に僕がいっぷせんさんから言われて、
僕が感動したことは、
うん。
今セメスターのグレードが全部Aだったと。
うん。
でもそんなことを喜ぶよりも週末金曜日に家族と一緒に映画を見れた。
その時間が自分のこの1週間のハイライトだったと。
うん、そう。
言いましたね。
僕が高校生や大学生だった時は、
全く逆に感じてた。
うん。
家族と一緒に過ごすのが本当に大切だとは思わなかったけど、
でも、僕は全部Aになれることにとても興奮してた。
うん、うん。
僕が全部Aになった時のハイライトだった。
うん。
でもその幸せはヒューゲーじゃないよね。
いやいやいやいや。
だから、僕は何かにコントロールされていたと思う。
うん。
そうしたら、君は僕に言ったんだけど、
最高の瞬間は家族と一緒に楽しい映画を見た。
それが1週間のハイライトだった。
うん。
他には何もなかった。
何もなかったけど、それは重要だった。
でも、家族と一緒に過ごす時は本当に幸せだった。
うん。
僕はこのメッセージを国に伝えたいと思う。
僕にとっては、幸せは家族と一緒に始まるんだ。
そういう人たちと一緒に過ごすことが大切だ。
僕の最高の思い出は、
家族と一緒だ。
僕が育っていた時、
お父さんは僕たちにハリーポッターの本を読んでくれた。
ああ。
彼は何をするかと言うと、
私たちは一章の最後に行く。
とても楽しみだった。
そして彼はこれをする。
次のページを見る。
うん。
ああ、それは本当に楽しみだ。
私たちは止めるべきだ。
そして、もちろん、私たちは言う。
ああ、お父さん、お願い。
ハハハハハ。
そして、僕はそれをまだ深刻に覚えている。
ああ、それは本当に素晴らしいことだ。
そう。
僕はとても幸運だと思う。
僕の家族は、
いつもとても素晴らしく、
とてもサポートしてくれる。
ああ。
彼らは私に言う。
あなたが幸せであれば、
私たちは幸せだ。
あなたが幸せであることをやりましょう。
次回もお楽しみに。
ご視聴ありがとうございました。
また来週お会いしましょう。
うまい。
みんな洋服ね。
僕は幸せだよ。
