00:03
I am Akane and Minami from IYASASA RADIO.
I am Akane and Minami from IYASASA RADIO.
Today's topic is 英語×沖縄ウチナーグチ. I am Akane and Minami.
Today's topic is 英語×沖縄ウチナーグチ. I am Akane and Minami from IYASASA RADIO.
Today's topic is 英語×沖縄ウチナーグチ. I am Akane and Minami from IYASASA RADIO.
I am Akane and Minami from IYASASA RADIO.
Today's topic is 英語×沖縄ウチナーグチ. I am Akane and Minami from IYASASA RADIO.
Today's topic is 英語×沖縄ウチナーグチ. I am Akane and Minami from IYASASA RADIO.
2020, I think.
Oh, yeah, yeah.
日本語で言うと、知り合いから連絡が来て、ペマとベラっていうお友達。
ベラは中国人で、ペマはブータンの人が沖縄に初めて来るから観光に連れて行ってと言われて。
海に行ったりとか。初めましてなのに、めっちゃ一緒に何日も出かけた友達です。
So it's been a while.
Yeah, it's been a while.
I think we came for my birthday. It was in March.
Oh, yeah, yeah. We did celebration at Izakaya, right?
Yeah, I was there. They surprised us.
But then, yeah, I came for my birthday and I think back then the pandemic wasn't that big.
Yeah, I remember that.
And I think it was only after that that it just went haywire and started blowing up.
But when we went there, tourists weren't allowed.
So we really enjoyed Okinawa because it wasn't very crowded.
Because we heard usually during that time it gets very crowded.
But I guess in that sense, thanks to the pandemic, we felt like we owned Okinawa.
It was so nice. It wasn't crowded at all.
It was a very beautiful experience.
And I think this is all owing to Akane and Norman.
They took us everywhere.
If not for them, I don't think we would have seen the many beautiful parts, other parts of Okinawa.
We would have been stuck in Naha and not really go any further than Naha.
03:01
So, yeah, thank you so much.
You're welcome.
It's been two years, but I was thinking having you as a guest in ESSA Radio would be very awesome.
Because you have so many perspectives from other countries.
And then I also want to know about you more through the radio.
And it's a very good opportunity for us.
So you currently live in Tokyo?
I actually live in Kanagawa.
Kanagawa.
But I work in Tokyo, in Shibuya.
In Shibuya?
When I'm in Tokyo, I go to an office at Daikanyama.
So I guess it's pretty close.
Yeah, true. Very close indeed.
Okay, so you're working at a company and also you're doing research at the university.
Yes.
It sounds so busy.
Yes, very, very busy.
I don't really have much time for social life.
So, yeah, my social life has now become very non-existent.
It's very non-existing.
Yeah, it's non-existent.
I don't have one in that sense.
So initially, I was not a full-time worker at Henge.
I used to work as a part-timer.
And that was before I was about to graduate from Todai.
And then I worked as a part-timer for six months.
And after that, I just asked them, like, oh, like, you know, would you hire me?
Like, you know, it'd be nice if you hired me because I'm about to graduate.
And for international students, you get like six months of job hunting visa.
And after that, if you don't land a job, then you basically have to leave the country.
So I was lucky enough because I got hired immediately.
I think I got hired while I was about to graduate.
So that the moment I graduated, I had a full-time job.
So this is all thanks to Henge.
So thank you so much for hiring me.
I love the company.
We're in the tech industry.
So we're a SaaS company, which means software as a service company.
And one of our products is Henge One.
So that's what we're selling to our clients.
And I've been now working since June 1st.
So it's been two months.
I'm having a very, like, fantastic time at Henge because it's a very progressive company.
I think with a lot of global members as well.
And thankfully, the company language, the official language is English.
So I get by without me, like, me not really having to speak a lot of Japanese.
But I'm also taking Japanese classes currently.
You have so many classes then.
University and also studying Japanese.
06:00
And working at a company.
Balancing that is, like, a challenge.
It's still a challenge for me.
I'm really having a hard time, but I'm enjoying it.
Like, I have a full-time job, which is from 9 to 6.
So I have a 9 to 6 job.
Then I have my thesis to write.
And I have Nihongo classes.
So, yeah.
It keeps me very occupied with not much to do.
How do you keep motivating yourself, like, studying for a long time?
Like, since you graduate school and you're still studying.
So, like, what do you motivate so much?
There was a time when I was a college dropout.
And I didn't really have, like, a stable source of income.
I was basically dilly-dallying and, like, you know,
going through, like, various tiny jobs here and there.
And I think during that time, I really got this wisdom that
if you do not have a stable job, like a good education,
then you don't really feel like you're part of,
or you don't feel that sense of belonging anywhere.
And after some time, people treat you like a burden.
So I had experienced that.
So because of that, I think the thing that motivates me even now
is that I look back at that time, and I tell myself,
do you want to be in that situation again?
And I don't want to be in that situation.
So, yeah, one thing that really motivates me is this for a fact.
And second thing would be because I'm alone in Japan,
and I'm not married.
So there's not, like, not one person that is there to take care of me.
So I have to make sure that I take care of myself.
And I think the end result, like, I can't wait until I hold my degree.
So I think that, like, you know, imagining that is what motivates me.
So you joining Todai University was the first time you came to Japan?
Not really.
When I was in college in Bhutan, we had this two-week cultural exchange
from the university that I was studying in
and one of the educational companies in Japan called SESA.
So I was here for a two-week cultural exchange.
And in that time, I was lucky enough, like, you know,
to meet the CEO and the founder of the SESA company.
And somehow when he came to Bhutan, he just offered me a job,
a permanent position, and he said, oh, like, you know,
if you want to study, which I had told him that I wanted to do my master's.
So he said he would sponsor, like, his company will sponsor me for that.
And that while I'm studying, I wouldn't have to work
or do any part-time jobs that I can completely focus on my studies.
09:01
So I felt like he understood my struggle.
And he realized, and one of the sweetest thing he said when he was alive,
I mean, unfortunately, he's no longer with us anymore,
is that he wants to see me succeed because in the beginning,
I had some doubts because I don't know him.
He was back then a stranger to me.
And for a stranger to be this kind and generous, I had my doubts.
But then after I came to Japan, all my doubts were gone
because I truly saw him as a very kind person.
And the fact that he was willing to give me a job,
sponsor my education, pay my rent, pay my bills, pay for my tuition.
I mean, it's really rare.
Like, for me, I still miss him.
Like, he is a very integral part of my life.
And I do not think I would have achieved this kind of success.
I wouldn't be here if not for him.
And I truly believe that he took a chance on me.
And I'm just happy that I was able to prove him right,
that he made the right decision.
So yeah, he also is one of the motivation that keeps me going
because if I don't do well, then it would feel like a betrayal to him
and the kindness that he showed me.
He's like your dad.
He's more like my fairy godmother.
Yeah, he definitely is my fairy godmother.
He took a chance on a person like me, brought me here.
And I think if I am to rate people in my life based on importance,
I think he would be number one.
Up there, then probably my parents.
But, like, when I experience someone take care of me very good
and very kind, I want to be like them.
And then I feel like I want to do something for people like them.
Feeling.
Maybe it's like very good influence from him.
It is.
And actually, in the long run, one of my dreams is to have my own foundation
and sponsor as many children as possible.
Like he gave a chance to me.
I want to be able to share that chance with him.
And there's this beautiful thing that he said before he passed away.
He told me when I asked him, why are you helping me?
Like, you're a stranger to me.
You don't know me.
Why are you helping me?
And he was like, oh, you have so many doubts.
You know, you have so many questions.
And I'm like, because I'm a woman.
And, you know, I, like, as a woman, I don't think we are like, you know,
the moment we're born, we're educated.
We're taught to not trust people.
And, yeah, so I had my issues back then.
12:03
But then he told me this very beautiful thing.
He said, with you, I'm planting a seed.
And when you grow into a tree, don't keep the fruits to yourself.
Instead, like, you know, plant more seeds.
So I do plan on keeping that legacy of his
and be able to sponsor as many kids as possible.
Currently, I'm only sponsoring one through Save the Children organization.
But hopefully once I start making enough money
and becoming more economically stable and financially stable,
I do intend on sponsoring more kids.
Wow. I mean, such a nice story.
Yeah, it passed only 10 minutes and you give me a really moving story already.
It sounds like ending now.
It's just that I've been very blessed to meet so many, like, wonderful people in my life.
And I don't know.
It's because of you.
Aw, thank you.
Jinx. Aw, thank you so much.
That's so sweet and kind.
Yeah, it's tearing me up.
But, yeah, definitely.
He just started.
I'm about to start crying already.
He was doing his studies at the university.
Before that, he was at Tokyo University.
And before that, we were talking about how he came to Japan.
What's his name again?
Miyazawa-san.
Is he like a mentor to you?
Like I mentioned, he's more like a fairy godmother to me.
Mentor, my guide, the person that I really look up to.
He has been a very impactful person in my life.
It's just amazing.
Because I've never seen that much kindness.
My own parents never showed me that much kindness.
Like, they paid for my college, but there was a deal.
It was like a contract.
They said, I have to make sure that I always bring A+.
With him, there was no contract whatsoever.
He just did it out of pure goodwill and good heart.
Now that he has passed away,
sometimes when I'm sleeping in bed, I do sometimes think that
there was a time when I doubted him and doubted his intentions.
Because, you know, he's a man after all.
He's a rich man.
And a rich man helping a poor woman.
It sounds like one of those bad movie plots.
But, yeah, the fact that...
15:01
I call him Jojo, actually.
In Dzongkha, in Bhutanese language Dzongkha,
Jojo means grandfather.
Because most of my paternal and maternal,
not most, all of them, they have passed.
My grandparents, they have all passed away.
So I basically honored him with the title of Jojo.
So I call him grandfather.
But he was more a friend and a mentor,
and a guide throughout my life.
He's everything.
Yeah, exactly.
We should ask about her.
Before you came back to Bhutan,
you went to the U.S. and then you struggled
earning money and then dropped out.
You should listen to her story.
Yeah, that's right.
The story of when she was in the U.S. in front of the lighthouse in Bhutan.
That's probably why I met her.
I went to the U.S. right after graduation.
So I finished high school when I was 17,
and then I immediately left for the U.S.
I initially wanted to go to India
because all my best friends from high school,
they were all going to India.
So I really wanted to go to India.
And I think one of the notions is that,
when your parents send somebody to the U.S. or Australia,
they might be rich, but it wasn't the case for me.
So a lot of the people,
when you go to America or Australia,
they paint this rosy picture.
But in my case, I was sent there.
And basically, I was on my own.
I had to work to pay my tuition.
I was wondering,
you told me that Bhutan people go to the university out of Bhutan
because they want to go to the private school.
Yes.
At the time, right?
Not anymore.
I don't think anymore now.
Because in Bhutan now,
we have a lot of government schools,
like higher institutions, higher educational institutions.
But we also have now private schools.
When I graduated,
which was back in 2008 or 2007,
I forgot.
It was that long time ago.
So back then,
we only had one government institution,
a higher educational institution.
And everybody would be basically targeting to get into that institution.
And because the competition was very rigorous and very hard,
18:01
I did not qualify to get into that school.
So we had to go to...
It wasn't a choice.
It wasn't like,
oh, I want to go outside the country to study.
But it was basically because you didn't qualify to study in the country.
So back then,
we didn't have any private schools during my time.
So that's why I wanted to go to India.
And a lot of the Bhutanese students,
after high school,
they go to India or Sri Lanka or Bangkok.
And I really wanted to go to India
because I love the Indian culture.
I think I'm one of the biggest fans of India.
I've always watched or seen Indian movies.
I grew up watching Indian movies.
And I feel very connected to the Indian culture.
So in that sense,
I wanted to go to India.
Bollywood.
Yeah, Bollywood.
But I couldn't.
My parents were like,
no, it's better for you to go to the US.
And yeah, so I left.
But Bhutan is still a developing company.
And then it must be expensive to go out of Bhutan
and then they go to university.
It's very hard work.
But people want to do that, right?
Yes.
And I clearly remember,
very clearly remember,
my mom and my dad had to put in a lot of effort,
take out loans in order to send me.
And back then, I didn't understand.
I was like, India's right next door.
It's much cheaper.
Why would you want to send me to America?
But now I understand that they wanted good education for me.
Like, you know, higher value education for me.
But then I think the start of it was all wrong.
We were trying to send this kid to America
with the money that we don't have.
We weren't rich.
We were very ordinary middle class people.
So I clearly remember my mom,
especially because I was raised by her.
She struggled a lot to put the money together to send me.
But yeah, both my parents chipped in
and they were able to send me with a tuition fee
that was only for one semester.
So at least for one semester,
I didn't really have to worry.
But after that, my dad was basically like,
you're on your own.
You're 18 now.
So you have to be financially independent.
So yeah, after I turned 18,
I don't remember ever taking any money,
not even a penny from my parents.
So I became financially independent at the age of 18.
And in the U.S., gosh, I struggled so much.
Also in Bhutan, there is no concept of part-time job.
I don't know about now.
So most of the things that I tell you about Bhutan
is my understanding of Bhutan when I was there.
And it's been a while since I haven't gone back to Bhutan.
So I don't know how things might have changed.
But during my time,
we didn't have the concept of part-time job.
So I had never worked.
21:01
I had never earned any money.
I had never even touched a computer.
And they sent me to the U.S.
And my first time making an ATM card,
I did not know how to because my English,
even though in Bhutan,
the medium of instruction in schools is English.
So we grew up learning English
ever since we were in kindergarten.
But I think it wasn't the English
that Americans or people from England or Australia uses.
It was very minimal knowledge of English.
So I struggled a lot with the language,
even though I spoke English.
Yeah.
So using an ATM card for the first time,
using a mobile, like a cell phone,
because I've never owned a cell phone before that.
The only cell phone that I owned was the Nokia,
the brick phone, the very old one.
That's very durable.
So that was the only phone I have had.
So I didn't know how to use the new phone,
the smartphones,
because I've never owned a smartphone before.
And even in the classes,
everybody would be taking notes on their laptops.
And I was there with my two fingers,
clicking one key at a time.
So it was a struggle,
but I got the hang of it.
And then, yeah,
I was working three jobs, part-time jobs.
So I would wake up around six,
go to my first job,
which was my first job was babysitting.
So I would make breakfast and pack lunch
for the kids that I was babysitting
and send them to school.
Once they go to school,
I would go back to college.
And from 10 a.m. to 3 p.m.,
I would be in college,
like taking classes.
And after 3 p.m.,
I had a shift at this Indian restaurant
that I worked as a waitress.
And from 3.30 to like 7,
I would be working in that Indian restaurant.
And at 7, from 7.30 to 3 a.m. in the morning,
I used to work in a club as a bartender.
So yeah, it was a very hard life.
I remember not having enough money.
So I remember eating ramen,
like not even the Korean or the Japanese ramen,
you know, the American ramen,
the top ramen, the very cheap noodles.
Yeah, I used to eat that for lunch and dinner.
I don't, yeah,
I didn't have a good habit of eating my breakfast,
but I used to have ramen,
top ramen for lunch and dinner.
So I remember being that miserable.
And that's when I decided, like,
I only had like one semester to graduate.
And I decided that this is not good living.
This is not good for me.
Like if I am putting a lot of money into my education,
I want an excellent degree from it,
not an average one.
So I just dropped out without telling my parents.
And then I basically ran away to New York.
I left LA and then went to New York.
24:01
There I just started picking like multiple shifts
because I enjoyed there a lot
because then now I could work like, you know,
more hours without having to worry about studying
or keeping up with my grades.
So it was all fun for a year or two.
But after that I got sick.
And yeah, so for two years I was in and out of the hospital
and the bills had accumulated a lot.
And then, yeah, and in 2013, no, in 2014,
my parents found out that I was sick
and they were like, come back.
Like, you know, and yeah, I went back empty handed,
no degree, no money.
And yeah, and once I reached Bhutan,
I really thought, you know, like,
oh, I'm going back to my family after seven years
because I had never gone back to Bhutan
in those seven years.
It was, everything came off.
You never went back to Bhutan for seven years?
Yep, never went back to Bhutan for seven years.
Yeah, my dad, like, my dad believes in non-attachment.
He does not really have attachment to anything,
not even to his children.
I remember telling my dad, like, you know,
oh, I made some money.
So can I use that money to fly to Bhutan?
And he's like, why do you have to come to Bhutan
and waste all that money?
We have Skype.
So he would be like, if you miss us,
we can Skype each other.
So yeah, so I grew up that way.
So which is why I think I'm, it was tough love.
And I'm glad that happened as well
because now I don't really get homesick or,
yeah, like I mentioned, I'm like a cockroach.
Like, you know, I survive anywhere.
Yeah, I don't really need anybody.
So I'm really good independent,
doing independent living.
But yeah, after I went back to Bhutan,
I realized that the real issue was me
sort of becoming like a burden to my family,
to my friends.
And yeah, then it really changed my notion
because I remember I went to this dinner
with my friends, a group of friends,
and we were discussing some political issues
and everybody like talked about their opinion on it.
And then I chipped in my opinion
and I remember this friend of mine clearly
because she was the reason I decided
to get my education
and get like one of the highest degrees
and everything.
So I'm glad she said that,
but she was like,
oh, you don't even have a bachelor's degree.
Like, you know, basically shut up
and that I'm not like, you know,
because I don't have a degree to support
or back my opinions that it's not valid.
So I felt very humiliated
and I think that humiliation made me stronger.
And that's when I basically told myself
that I'm going to turn my life around,
get a good education
and then not depend on anybody anymore.
So yeah, that's how I came about to Bhutan
27:01
and that's how I went back to college
and started from scratch.
Wow.
That's amazing.
She's a strong woman.
What about Bhutan or America?
Yaku?
Yeah.
Before coming to Tokyo,
after I graduated from high school in Bhutan,
I was sent to America
to get a good education.
Is that the right way to say it?
So I went to America,
but the tuition was so expensive
and I only had like one semester
and I didn't have any money.
So in order to keep up with that,
I took three part-time jobs
and after taking classes,
I was like, I can't do this anymore.
So I dropped out of school,
went to New York,
and started working as usual.
Then I got sick
and had to pay a lot of bills.
My parents found out about it
and I decided to go back to Bhutan.
When I was talking to my friends,
they told me that I didn't even have a bachelor's degree.
They told you that you can't go to university
one year before your bachelor's degree.
I don't know what they actually said,
but they said something terrible.
So I decided to study hard
and get a good education.
And when I was in Bhutan,
there was a program called SEISA.
There was a Japanese...
I forgot his name.
Miyazawa-san?
Yes, Miyazawa-san.
He came to Japan
and asked me if I wanted to work there for a year.
I told him that I wanted to go to school
and that I wanted to come to Japan
and I studied hard.
I also went to Bhutan University.
I went to Bhutan University
and when I was in Bhutan,
I decided to go to Japan.
I studied a lot.
When I searched for the best university,
I found TODAI.
I only applied for TODAI and got accepted.
Yes.
That's a great story.
And I went to Japan.
Yes.
That's how I made it this far.
Hustle is also true.
Goen was a rich man.
At first, Pema was also a woman.
I didn't think she would do something.
I was suspicious of her,
30:01
but she supported me by raising me.
I paid all my rent and school fees.
I had a job and could go to school.
She is a fairy godmother.
Fairy godfather.
It's like a movie.
Yes.
I still work and study Japanese.
I'm still studying hard,
but now I have Pema.
Yes.
That's great.
That's great.
Such a hard worker.
Thank you.
I wasn't always like that.
Life taught me to work harder.
Definitely.
How many languages do you speak?
By virtue of being a Bhutanese,
I think most Bhutanese are trilingual.
We can speak English,
Dzongkha, our native language,
and Hindi.
I'm not sure.
I think my generation could speak Hindi,
but not anymore.
The new generations are very much evolved.
They have moved on to either Japanese,
Korean, or English.
And Nepali.
You're basically born with that knowledge
of four languages.
Nice.
The Bhutanese can speak English,
most of them?
Yes, most of them.
Everybody that has gone to school
I'm just curious,
how you speak English,
Bhutanese accent,
it sounds to me like American English.
Really?
I've heard people say that I have an Indian accent,
sometimes.
Is this Indian accent?
I have no idea.
Maybe you started from Indian accent English,
but you went to the States,
and you became really westernized.
What about your friends?
Most of your friends understand English,
and they can speak and communicate?
Yes.
That's amazing.
You're a genius.
Japanese people can only speak one language.
That's because of the difference in their accents.
It can't be helped.
If you have three accents,
that means...
It's the same in Singapore.
In Singapore, they speak like a Singlish,
like a very strong accent.
But like,
Bhutanese English?
I was wondering,
is your accent
came from Bhutan,
inspiration, or
it's just only you?
33:01
I think,
I don't know anymore,
but I do believe it's a mix of
Indian accent,
maybe a little bit of American accent,
and Bhutanese accent.
But I have heard
my friends,
like Bella,
and some of my other close friends,
that sometimes when I get very passionate
while talking,
my Indian accent comes out.
It's hard because
I grew up watching Indian television,
watching only
Bollywood movies.
Which is why I'm very influenced
by the, I think,
the Indian accent.
And even the language, Hindi.
But when you speak with
your family, you speak
Zanka?
Zanka and English.
You speak English?
That's amazing.
Really amazing.
And then, what else?
With my family, only English or Zanka.
And with my
Indian friends, we speak Hindi or
English.
But the beauty
about languages is that you can mix them.
So, I can
mix Zanka in English,
I can mix Nepali in English,
I can mix Hindi in English.
These days, because I'm just beginning
to study the Japanese language,
I sort of mix them with Korean.
Sometimes when I'm speaking
Nihongo, my Korean comes out.
Wow.
I also studied Korean, so
now it's
becoming like a whole mixing pot
in my brain.
To the point,
I don't know if you saw one of those memes
on Instagram. It's like,
you're not bilingual,
you're bilingual.
So, once you start speaking
a lot of languages, sometimes, I think
the danger is
you will forget your own language.
So, there is always that danger.
But, I'm glad
that when I speak Zanka,
I can speak just purely Zanka.
If I'm
speaking Hindi, I can also
purely speak Hindi.
And when I'm speaking English, I can purely
speak English. But then, sometimes,
I do struggle. Sometimes,
I'm thinking about a word, and sometimes
I'll speak in Zanka to a Japanese
person. So,
that also happens.
Can you introduce yourself in
Zanka, Hindi,
and Nepali?
Nepali? Yeah.
Alright. So, Zanka would be
like, my name is Pema Selden.
I'm from Bhutan.
I was born and raised in Bhutan.
I live in Japan.
So, basically,
I said, my name is Pema Selden.
I come from Bhutan, and it's been three years
since I moved to Japan.
And in Hindi,
my name is Pema.
It's been three years
since I came to Japan.
36:01
So,
yeah, I'm saying the same thing.
Exactly.
I think, right now, it feels a bit
unnatural, even when I'm speaking
Zanka in Hindi,
because I'm put in the spot.
So, it sounds a bit unnatural.
But, you know,
if, I think,
if we were organically speaking these languages,
it would feel more natural.
Because when I'm with my Indian friends,
like, if people
didn't see my face, they would actually
think, yeah, because
I speak Hindi like,
you know, like a
native Indian.
Yeah, so,
it's very easy for me to
communicate with my Indian friends
in Hindi.
I'm so happy that
they don't sound like an American speaking Hindi.
They can understand my Hindi.
So, yeah.
And I have Nepali friends, so
that's how I grew up to learn
Nepali as well.
If you can speak multiple languages so fluently,
then
is there any, like, which
language you feel most comfortable
with, or is, like, everything equal?
Like, those three languages.
I think I'm most comfortable with my
like, my
country's language, Dzongkha, and English.
So, Dzongkha and English
probably I'm most comfortable
with.
Is your personality a bit changed?
In Dzongkha
and English?
Does my personality
change? I think I'm able
to express more
in English than I
am able to express more in Dzongkha.
So, yeah, there's
that, but I think personality-wise
in both Dzongkha and
English, I'm very comfortable.
Yeah.
I think not much.
There's not much difference.
Like, in our case,
like, when we speak Japanese,
we tend to be more, like,
polite, and then
...
Not straightforward.
In Japanese,
have, like, high context
to say a thing, so we cannot
say a thing directly, but in
English, like, it's just...
Openly. Yeah, really simple as
in one word.
Outgoing personality
comes out. Yeah, there is
no difference then.
It depends on who I'm speaking to,
regardless of the person being comfortable
in English or Dzongkha.
It depends on the person, so if it's an
elder, then
regardless of it being in English or Dzongkha,
I'll be more polite and respectful,
but if I'm talking to my friends, my mom,
my father, yeah, I think both
English and Dzongkha, same
level of respect and politeness.
What about when you speak
Japanese?
Japanese, because I'm
39:01
studying Japanese, and I'm not
very familiar with the
day-to-day, you know,
nuances, or, like, I'm not
very familiar with the Japanese nuances
yet, so my Japanese,
I think, is very polite,
like, business-level polite.
Like a textbook.
Yeah, so, like,
お手巻き申します。
So, my Japanese is very,
very polite, so I think
Japanese would be the most
polite for me. I change
my personality when I'm speaking Japanese,
but that's only because
I don't know casual Japanese.
I've only learned textbook Japanese,
which are very dignified and
very refined.
That's the only reason,
but, I don't know, I'm thinking
one day when I do become fluent,
I wonder how I would talk to
Akane, like, you know?
I'm not sure.
Yeah.
You speak French a little bit, too?
I studied French for three years,
but that was back in the U.S.,
so it's been a decade
at the last touch.
So, very beginner, I think,
right now.
Never stop studying.
Yeah, it feels like that.
I feel like,
I don't want to, like, after my second
degree, I don't want to study anymore.
Actually, Miyazawa-san,
he had actually
extended this
goodwill to
PhD, so he said,
you know, we'll sponsor for your Masters
and PhD, but
I was like, I'll do two Masters
degrees and no PhD, because I'm like
so done with studying right now.
I feel like I've been studying my entire life.
I feel like if I have
to read another academic article
or another piece of academic
writing, I would
literally throw up, so I don't want
to study anymore. I think I'm really
done studying.
Yeah.
You told me about you're working on
a thesis at your
Seoul National University.
What is your, like,
major, or, like, what are you
studying?
In Seoul, my major was public
policy and international relations.
42:01
In Seoul, my
major
is international studies
and international corporation.
My major is that.
The thesis that I'm doing right now,
I really wanted to do on the
US-China
rivalry, but my professor was like,
everybody's doing a thesis on that,
so, like, you might want to pick something
unique.
I was like, I'm a Bhutanese,
like, you know, what else can be
unique than being a Bhutanese?
Yeah, like, in the
world, there are only around 800,000
Bhutanese, so there are not even
a million, and I think that's why
I'm the first Bhutanese
that Akane has ever interacted
with or met with,
because it's very rare.
My professor suggested that I do
something like a single country study on Bhutan,
and I thought,
yeah, true.
For that, my thesis topic
is basically, I'm trying to prove that
social capital helps
in sort of
building public health,
or, like, you know, it's a determining
factor in determining
what kind of public health the country
or the economy would have.
So, I'm trying to prove that,
and I'm using the case of
the pandemic and social capital
in Bhutan, and Bhutan being a
developing country, the reason, I do
believe strongly that the reason
why we had, like,
comparatively successful
management of the pandemic is
because of our strong and very
powerful social capital that Bhutan
has. So, that's what I'm
trying to prove. I'm still,
yeah, I still
get very distracted because I feel like
I don't really get the time to write my thesis,
but I'm intending
on graduating next
year, February, so
I have to make time and write
my thesis. Even though I'm very
interested in my topic, I just
dread the writing part.
Mm-hmm.
What's the, like, unique point
of the Bhutan social capital
for you? Oh, I think
this is all based on
the way Bhutan
45:01
measures development.
We have something called the Gross National Happiness,
and we give
more importance,
I mean, we do consider, it's not like we
totally ignore economic
development, but we consider
that people's happiness
is more
important than,
and not just happiness, but people's well-being
is more important than
your GDP, which is the Gross Domestic
Product, so we
tend to measure happiness.
The GNH has four
pillars, so let me
see if
I can remember all the four pillars,
because this is one of the topics
that I'm very interested in, invested in.
So, the first pillar,
I don't know in accordance,
but roughly it would be
good governance, then protection, and
conservation of environment,
then preservation
of our culture and tradition,
and the fourth one would be
sustainable economic development.
So, based on that four
pillars, we also have
driven nine indexes
or domains through
which we calculate happiness, so
it would be like
the mental
well-being of a person, the
health of a person, education,
how accessible is
universal health and education to these
people, then
how much community, like sense of
community and belonging do we have,
then
how much importance do we give to our
environment that we live in, how
I think, how communal
are we in the society,
and also I think, yeah, living
standards. So, that's
how you measure happiness,
and yeah, because Bhutan is
developing, I wouldn't say that Bhutan is
free of all like
socioeconomic challenges.
We do have very heavy
socioeconomic challenges, especially I think
when it comes to living standard, poverty,
and I think right
now mainly climate change is
impacting our country a lot because
we're on the Himalayas, right,
and with the
increasing in temperature, global
temperature, the ice caps are melting,
we are facing a lot of
floods, like a
glacial lake outburst
because Bhutan has a lot
of lakes as well because we are on
a mountainous country, I mean on a
mountainous region, so we
face all those issues, so we do have
issues, but at least when it
comes to accessibility, and
I'm not speaking for the entire
population, but majority-wise
we do have good access, free
access to health and education.
We have also
started giving a lot of importance to mental
health and well-being.
So in that sense, yeah, we're pretty
peaceful. We have
the most, the kindest,
the most benevolent king
in the monarchs
ever, I think.
One of the best leaders in the world
48:01
from my observation,
if I may say so myself,
but yes, I think Bhutan is
protected from a lot of the
things that the rest of the world
is going through right now, especially
wars, like a lot of the countries
are in war and in conflict,
trying to get democracy,
trying to get liberated, right?
But in Bhutan, we were
a monarchic system,
we had a monarchic system of government
and the king was the sole power, he had
the only, like he was the only person in power,
but we didn't
have to fight for democracy. For us,
democracy was served to us
on a silver platter by our king.
So in that sense, we do
believe that we're blessed.
We also realize that
we're privileged compared to
a lot of the countries or
a lot of people in other countries.
And for me, at least,
I never take these privileges lightly.
I'm proud
to be a Bhutanese, but
at the same time, I also do realize that
we're privileged and we need
to know that we're privileged.
And I think this is all thanks to our
monarchs.
But working on
you know, thesis about social
capital is like really timely
and great for
the people all over the
world, I think, like rethinking
about how the connection
among the people can
empower people and, you know,
makes us
happy and everything.
And
yeah, I didn't know about
GNH.
Yes, definitely.
I mean,
And Bhutan
was
Yes,
so
this study
is a great topic
during the pandemic
and
it's not just about money.
Now, politics is
a democratic country,
but I don't know if it's really like that in Japan.
But Bhutan
is
education,
education, health, mental health,
51:01
being, health,
and community
are close and we can help each other.
I think that's the
secret of happiness in Bhutan.
We need to improve
the economy,
and the Himalayan area
is affected
by the weather,
global warming, and
pollution,
but
these three factors
I think that's why
GNH is so high.
That's a good topic.
It's a good study.
So, I want to ask
about the king
of your country.
How is the relationship
between you and the king?
The king and his subjects.
Bhutan's king
was handsome.
Yeah, one thing that sets him
apart from
the other monarchs
or kings of other countries.
Obviously, first of all, good looks.
He's very good looking,
but another thing is he's very
down to earth and very
humble.
I think his humility is something,
one of the first things that I fell in love with
was his humility
and the fact that
he wouldn't
like,
the king and the queen and
the prince,
his royal highness, they actually came to
Japan, and the first
thing that they did was call upon
all the Bhutanese in
Japan, and then he met with us,
and then he basically talked
to us. So, in that
sense, even accessibility,
like access to the king,
it's
there, and
I think in the first few conversations
I was also telling you about how
sometimes you can bump into him.
My first encounter
with the king
face to face, in person,
was I was on a hike.
I was just going for a morning hike,
and then I think he was riding his
bicycle, and then
we met each other, and
me and my cousins, we got
really excited, and we were like, hi!
And then he waved back
at us, and he was like, oh,
please stay in school.
He was giving that very leaderly
advice.
In that sense, yeah, he's very,
very humble, very
humble, and I have,
I think, had the good fortune of
bumping into him
three times now,
and every time, I remember
he would at
least say something,
and the way he talks to you,
it's just, yeah, even for me, it's very
humbling.
Yeah, I think he is one of the best
examples of how leaders should be,
and not just that,
I think the way he conducts
himself, the way he throws
54:01
himself to the service of the people
in the country, it's
very, very, I think, commendable,
admirable, and
I don't know, like, usually
as a student of politics, I'm very
cynical and very skeptical about
leaders, and the way
these leaders lead their subjects
or their countries,
but with him, I try to view him from
every angle possible,
I just haven't been able to find
a flaw yet,
so, yeah, I think for Bhutanese
as well, there is a lot of trust
in the king, so I think
that's another huge social capital
there, because
during the pandemic, the king actually came
live on TV, and he was addressing
everyone in the country,
and telling us to quarantine,
that there will be a lot of
lockdowns, nationwide lockdowns
happening, and then he apologized for that,
but at the same time, he hopes that
as people of the country, we have
to stand united, so
every time he says something,
the people follow, because we have
that respect,
that kind of reverence for him,
so, yeah, and I personally
too, and I think I speak
on behalf of every Bhutanese, we
revere our king, we just
are so in love, like knee-deep
in love with our king.
How did your
parents or
school teach about
the king?
They are in the
Bhutanese history books,
they are there, because
Bhutan is also a very
I think,
Bhutan, we had our first
king in 1907,
so
from that time
onwards, we had
leaders, and after that,
right now we are on our fifth
king, so we have the fifth king right now,
and it's pretty hereditary, so
the king, the monarchy
sort of passes from the father to son,
and yeah, so that's
what Bhutan has been following so far,
and because
in 2008, the
fourth king granted us,
basically gifted us democracy,
so he decentralized his power
and gave his power to the people,
and now we have a
very, like how
it is in the UK, a very
bicameral parliament, where we have
a monarch, we have king and queens,
but we also have
prime minister,
we have
elections, we have all of that,
so we were very lucky,
we didn't have to shed blood in order
to get there,
and it was, I think, the first I didn't
You guys have prime minister too?
Yes, we do.
Oh, okay.
And yeah, currently,
our prime minister is a doctor,
so he's a surgeon,
he's one of the best surgeons in the country.
What do you think about the prime minister though?
What do you think about prime minister?
I,
57:01
the thing is, I can't
have anything right now, like,
to say, because I haven't really studied
his form of government,
I have not been in the country
to experience his leadership,
but I've actually met him once
through SESA,
so,
Miyazawa-san and I went to
Bhutan for a very short
of, it was like a business trip,
so we went there, and then
I was lucky enough that, you know,
Miyazawa-san took me with him
to this dinner, where we were having dinner
with one of the princesses,
and the prime minister,
and yeah, I took a picture with him,
he also is very humble,
so, as far
as, you know, my
opinion on him goes, I don't
know how he's ruling the country
right now, because I'm not there, and I don't think
it would be fair for me to judge his
leadership, but
yeah, when I met him, he was
very humble, and yeah,
just, it doesn't
even feel like you're dining with the prime
minister, it felt more like
yeah, you're
talking to a teacher.
In Bhutan,
do you guys talk
about politics, like amongst friends,
like casually?
No, I don't think we,
I have experienced that, I have experienced this
more in Bodai, because
every time we open our mouth, we always
talk about politics,
we talk about segregation,
we talk about the
ills of the world, so,
this happened after I started taking
politics as my major,
but back in Bhutan,
we don't really talk about politics
much, but then yeah, we do dive into
the topics of,
like, you know, the election, we talk about
the election, but
yeah, I don't think I've ever
had a friend have very strong
opinion about the
government, and I wouldn't say
our government is free from corruption,
we do face corruption, like problems of corruption,
but I don't think,
I don't know, it hasn't been
given that much
of a spotlight,
like when you hear about Bhutan,
it's not the first thing you hear,
oh, corruption in Bhutan, it's not the first thing
that you hear, I think when you talk
about Bhutan, or even Google Bhutan,
the first thing you would see is either there are kings,
or the gross national happiness,
like, you know, the development philosophy
of the country,
so yeah, we have
our challenges and problems,
but I don't think that's what
really defines the country right now,
and I hope even in the future that's
the case, and
yeah, the more
I look at other countries, the more
I do feel, sort
of, like I mentioned,
privileged to be a Bhutanese,
because yeah, I don't think
I've ever experienced a protest,
I've never experienced
violence on the street,
so yeah,
1:00:01
it does make me feel like I'm not exposed
to a lot of things, but
at least when it comes to violence on that
level, like, I've never experienced
such things, yeah.
Yes.
Yes.
She's a bridge of Bhutan and Japan.
For me,
not really, I wouldn't consider that.
I think it's like a
job specification
that Sesa gave me when I was working
for them, because Sesa
does a lot of,
I think,
a lot of charitable work in Bhutan.
Sesa has
donated a lot of wheelchairs to the
Paralympic members of the Paralympic
Committee in Bhutan,
even the Olympics Committee.
Sesa has also donated a lot of,
I think, resources to
the education industry, I mean,
the education ministry in Bhutan,
so in that sense, also
because, yeah, I was a Bhutanese,
I am a Bhutanese,
they felt like having a Bhutanese face
would
help, so they just called me that,
you know, we hope you realize
that by working with us, you're sort of
like a bridge between Sesa
and Bhutan, but I don't think,
I've only worked with them for
a year, so I don't think
I have done much
to deserve that sort of
accolade, but
I think
when I was working for them,
they used to be, and I think
that's just not for me when I was
working for them, I think, for Bhutanese
at least, because there's only
very few Bhutanese, like,
you know, the Bhutanese diaspora is very small,
anywhere you go in the world,
we feel like wherever
a Bhutanese goes, we have
1:03:01
to represent, like, we're taking our country
with us, so we have to represent Bhutan
in such a manner that
when you're talking to somebody, you're
not just talking on behalf of yourself,
you're representing the entire
country, so
yeah, it's sort of like a responsibility
of being a Bhutanese,
and I
like to believe that
I did my part in that
while I was working for CESA,
but still, I wouldn't
say, like, oh, I was the bridge, because
they already had, like, you know,
a relationship with Bhutan
way before I even came into the picture.
So if, you know, you've been in
Japan for a while,
and I think
it's important
of, you know,
like a people
connection makes, you know,
stronger and happier
society, and if you compare
with Bhutan
or the states or the
people in Japan, do you think
we, you know, Japanese
people don't really have
much of a people's connection
anymore, like you live in Kanagawa
or in Tokyo, like
it's a good example of people really
detach each other,
you know, they are
physically close, but they don't care about, you know,
people.
True, but I think
because I live in Kanagawa,
and I live in a place that's very,
it's a very residential area,
it's not like Tokyo,
so if I'm to speak for my
own personal experience, I don't
see a lot of difference between Bhutanese
and Japanese, because at least in my
building, I know my neighbors, because
when I first moved in,
like one of my colleagues
from SESA told me that you have to go
introduce yourself to everybody in the building
and carry a small like
omiyage, yeah, like
a small gift, so I didn't know
what to buy, and I remember buying
like towels, bath towels,
and ziplock bags,
and just knocking on the door
and be like, oh,
you know, like
yeah, like
so
I basically went around
introducing myself, and even when
other people, new people moved into the
building, yeah, I remember this
one person, like not
even one, I think three of them came knocking
at my door with a little like goodie
bag, like small gift, and
then they introduced themselves to me
so in that
sense, I mean, I don't talk to them
or go to their houses, like
in Bhutan, it's very typical, if
you have neighbors, sometimes if you're bored in your house
you can go to your neighbor's house, like
you know, do things with them, so
of course, that kind
of, that level of, I think
community vitality
is not there, but
for a developed country, for a developed
1:06:01
nation like Japan, I think it's
still in the right track, like people
still have that sense of community
people still come to your door
and introduce themselves
and I strongly
believe that after living in Japan for three
years, I think Japan has spoiled me
thoroughly, because
every time I leave Japan or fly somewhere
outside of Japan, the moment
I land in another international
airport and not Japan
you can tell, like you know, the way
people talk to you
like you know, I feel very entitled
and I'm like, that's a very mean way
to say something to me
or even when I land in
Bhutan, people can be very direct
and because I have
gotten accustomed and used
to a certain level of politeness
in Japan, I feel
like, oh, you know, I'm so used to it that
I sort of expect that from
other countries as well, so
yeah, I don't see
much problem, the only problem
I have with Japan is the constant
earthquake, that's my
only issue with Japan, apart
from that, I love this country
I am, like you know,
I was blessed enough to meet with so many
good people, like I never
like I mentioned earlier
I'm a very, like you know
I wouldn't, okay, I think
judgmental has a very
bad connotation, but then yeah, I
guess I am very judgmental and very
cynical about things, but
at least in Japan, everybody that I
have met have only been
like very kind and gracious to me
and yeah, so
far, like I said, the only problem
I would have
with Japan is the very frequent
earthquakes, like the earthquakes never stop
and I'm not very
used to earthquakes
even though it is said that Bhutan
you know, the geographical
position of Bhutan is on, like you know
a very earthquake prone zone
but I do not remember experiencing
earthquakes in Bhutan
at least of this magnitude, I think the
one, the biggest earthquake that I experienced
was I think, very recent, right?
It was 7.1 on a magnitude
scale, yeah, from
Sendai or Fukuoka or something, yeah
so I remember
being here, I remember
crawling under the table and the entire
like you know, yeah
the power outage, there was a whole block
power outage, everything was
dark and I remember going
under my desk and crying
and even
then, the people in SEISA
they showed so much kindness
so they know I'm terrified of
earthquakes, so
there's a colleague of mine
he's more like a guardian, he's also
like a mentor to me, very nice
so his name is Ishida-san and
Ishida-san would call me and then
always be like, oh don't cry, like you know
I checked, there's no tsunami warning, you're
safe and yeah, he's
the only person in Japan
or even in the world, that
will always message me or call me
right after an earthquake, just to
1:09:01
assure me, like you know, that
oh everything is fine, no tsunami
warning, because I live next to the beach
my biggest fear is that, yeah
tsunami, because I've watched so many videos
on YouTube
about that 2011 tsunami
and yeah, I just
yeah, I cannot imagine
the pain, like you know
people, like the Japanese people
went through, especially in 2011
so, every time
I see those videos, it just makes me wanna cry
so yeah, every time there's an
earthquake, I will crawl under my desk
and cry
and cry
but you have people to support
yes
even though
I live alone, I do have
a lot of, like you know
support from
my friends, I have like
the best set of friends
I have the best colleagues
yeah, like
even my colleagues from
SESAT, I'm still in touch with them
they still help me
whenever I'm in need, whenever I need
a translation, whenever I need help
with going to a hospital or something
so yeah, people
have just been, I don't know
like, what I did to deserve this
but yeah, like people just have
very amazing
always there, always willing to help
so yeah, that's the Japan that I
experienced
I think it's because of your personality
and then you appreciate what you have
and then people
what people do to you
and then, you know
you are independent, but you
still need some support because you live
out of
your country
but like
and then
you feel happy
like
you feel connected to people
yeah, I think so
yeah
like
since Bhutan
is the most happiest
country
but in your opinion though
in your opinion, like what's the
definition of happiness?
I wouldn't say Bhutan
is the happiest country because
statistically that would be wrong
I think either Norway
or Finland or one of those countries
I think are very high ranking
in the happiness index
but I do believe that Bhutan
is a happy country
1:12:01
the way I
define happiness is not
like how much wealth or
material things that you have accumulated
over your
lifetime, but it's more
like I mentioned before
how
accessible or
how much access do you have to
basic human rights
how much access do you have to
basic education
and universal health
so those are how I consider
or even like
I think one of the best defining
feature of Bhutan is that Bhutan
at least if my knowledge is serving
right, but you can fact check me on that
Bhutan I think is the only
country in the world that is carbon negative
so we produce more
oxygen than carbon dioxide and I think
that's something that the rest of
the world is struggling with
because they produce more carbon than oxygen
so in that sense
I think that's how I define happiness
the fact that we have
good air to breathe
we don't have to worry that
on our way to school
there might be people who
might take us or there might be
a war that breaks out
there is no conflict
so in that sense we are peaceful
and I think we are also very
self-sufficient
and everything
like most of the development
developmental activities
that happen in Bhutan
is under the observation
of the gross national happiness indexes
so all the activities
that happens in Bhutan like be it
environmental activities or developmental
it has to make sure
that it meets certain criteria
whereby
whatever you're trying to build
or whatever you're trying to develop
does not impact the environmental
state of Bhutan
so in that sense I like that
and it might mean that we might have
to forsake a little bit on the economic
development but I think that's
okay as long as you're not homeless
as long as you have a roof over your head
as long as you don't have to
worry about where the next meal is going
to come from
I think you're happy
that's how I define happiness
and I believe that in Bhutan
we don't have homeless people
at least now I don't want to
offend people by saying that
but then as far as
my knowledge serves
as far as I know
I have never seen a homeless person
in Bhutan
if they're ever
in villages I do remember this one person
who was about to go homeless
the community
the trust in the community
the societal values
is so strong
that I remember somebody had taken him in
because he was about to go
homeless
somebody took him in, somebody gave him a job
so he was saved
from being famished
or being poor
1:15:01
or homeless
I think that is what happiness is
and should be
I think it's a very good model for other countries
to follow as well
but I also believe that
it cannot be easily replicated
because I've talked about this in my political
classes and I got a lot of backlash
and I agree with them
sometimes when I talk about peace
it does make me sound very privileged
and entitled
and it is because I lack
outside knowledge because I have never been
exposed to violence
or conflict so I do believe
that peace is easy
but I also understand when people
were telling me
rebuttaling my arguments
by saying that it's not replicable
it's irreplicable
in Bhutan because Bhutan has
so much social capital
a lot of land
a lot of forest area
and very little people
Bhutan's population is very small
so it's easy to control a small population
and make it happy
but when you're talking about 23 million
people like in the case of Japan
it's really hard to replicate that
sense but I think Japan
I really believe that Japan
is on the right track
like I said I have met materialistic
people but I've also
felt like Japan has this
beauty of holding on to
customs and traditions
and I don't think
you should give up on that
I think you should hold on to it
the respect that they exude
for their elders, these are all
tradition and culture and I think
it's what makes Japan unique
and it is one of the biggest
soft power of Japan as well
and coming from a developing poor country
I really believe
in the power of soft power
because Bhutan does not have any
hard power, we don't have military power
we don't have a lot of money
we're not a rich country
so we don't have anything, the only thing that
Bhutan can depend on is the
soft power which is the strength in our
environment
the value that we place on the environment
the trust
the culture that we
hold on to dearly, our language
our identity is the soft
power that Bhutan has
and I think that's why Bhutan is also
very peaceful with all the other countries
we have a very good relationship with all the other countries
we're not really in conflict
with a lot of
countries, let's just say that because I don't want to turn
this discussion very political
but yeah, we don't
really have conflicts with a lot of
countries, I wouldn't say we don't have conflict with
any country but
we're pretty good when it comes to
our diplomatic ties
Bhutan still has more than 70%
forest left
so that the number of tigers doesn't increase too much
the human and the natural world
are separated
and the community is close
and it's not materialistic
so the soft power is
1:18:01
being used properly
and the population isn't increasing too much
so the happiness level is being maintained
that's what we're talking about
the good thing about Japan is that
the population is increasing and it's getting
difficult to control but
they're taking care of the traditional culture
and it's unique
so if you look at it from
a different country's point of view
Japan has that kind of thing
that's what Pema said
they're taking care of the
traditional culture
and Bhutan is the only country
that produces a lot of oxygen
that's amazing
more than carbon
when I asked you about
the happiness level
you said that the amount of oxygen
is the answer
that Pema said
other than that
I have a house to live in
I have food to eat
I don't have a home lesson
if I have a basic life
that's what makes me happy
so I'm 100%
agreed
about it
even you're in Japan
you still have like
very good relationship with your family
as you said
yes, I'm in constant touch with them
that makes you happy
too, right?
yeah, it does actually
because I have a very supportive set of parents
they have never been
that typical Asian parent
that forces you to do well
I remember I was studying
and my mom was like, it's okay
sometimes you're allowed to fail
don't worry too much
and while I was worrying about my
master's degree in Seoul National University
and I was basically stressing a lot
and having a lot of anxiety and panic
attacks over my thesis
my mom was like, you already have one master's
degree, it's okay
give up on the other
in that sense
I do have very supportive parents
at least supportive mother
she never
really forces too much
onto me
and I have the most
understanding and trustworthy
set of sisters
and I can tell them anything
and they will never judge me
so yeah, I do have very very intimate
close relationship with my family
yeah
that's nice
you're close with your family
we're close with our family
and we support each other
I think what we all have in common
is the distance we have
and the strength
we have
we're similar
in Okinawa
we're the same
no matter where we are
but yeah
the distance
and the people
we have in common
yeah
you can't be happy
just because you're rich
1:21:03
I totally agree
that's why I moved to Okinawa
oh yes, Okinawa
I love
I think it's also very
there's a lot of societal values
people are very close to each other
it's something
that you don't see in Tokyo
yeah
I think the difference between
the level of happiness
and the level of poverty
is the amount of money
I think that's the difference
it's almost capitalism
for some reason
you can't be happy
even if you don't have money
or even if you have money
it's not the same
it's not the same
if you didn't have money
it wouldn't be like this
this is like
how close you are
you currently
working at Hengen
and working
thesis
at the university
in the near future
is there anything you wanna do
in Japan
or you wanna go somewhere else
or you're going back to Bhutan
or anything
is there any future plan
the only future plan
this is very far away
a lot of years
down the road
I do want to be able to
have and set up my own foundation
where I
like an NGO of a sort
where I sponsor kids
who come from a very
very struggle
some background
and I would like to help them
the way my sponsor had helped me
so that is the ultimate
goal for me
but I do not really have anything
any plans set in stone
as to what I will do
in the next 5 years
I think the next 5 years I will be in Japan
because my work visa
is for the next 5 years
apart from that
after that I'm not sure
I do want to apply to the UN
and be able to work for the UN
but I'm not sure
being from Bhutan
I don't think there is a lot of
opportunities
to work for the UN
because
the one thing I realized about the UN
1:24:01
in order to get in
you also have to be
a country
that donates a lot to the UN's cause
and because Bhutan is poor
we do not really donate a lot of
funds to the UN
which is why there are only limited
amount of seats for Bhutanese
reserved for Bhutanese
to work in the UN
but I would like to definitely try for that
I've always wanted to work for the
UNESCO
for the children
so if I do
even get to
put my feet in there I think I'm willing
to make that move
but apart from that I'm in love
with my job, the job that I have right now
I'm in love with the company that I'm working for
so
nothing set in stone
but yeah
I don't mind
being able to live in Japan
I love your
you know, I love how you
appreciate for everything
yeah
you're talented
you have sweetheart
and then
working for the NGO
and UNESCO
is like a job change
yeah
raising the happiness of the world
yeah
but like this is
what you wanna do
at like
NGO or like UNESCO
yes
was influenced by Miyazawa-san too
yes yes definitely
I mean even before him
I've always wanted to be able to either
adopt and sponsor a lot of
kids
or like you know
I can't adopt them
like just sponsor kids
but after meeting Miyazawa-san
I think it sort of became
more solidified
like I really wanted to go down that path
because I know
the sense of gratitude that I have
for Miyazawa-san
and I want
to give that sense of happiness
you know to others as well
so that they can also feel like
oh my goodness I am so happy that
my education believed in my dreams
because yeah
when Miyazawa-san met me
I didn't really have anything to prove to him
that I'm like a very good student
you know apart from the two weeks
cultural exchange that I did in Japan
that was the only
time he was able to communicate
with me and see me
so I'm not even sure why out of
many people he chose me
to sponsor
but the fact that he did
I'm not going to ever forget that
I think I will always be
I think
I don't know indebted to him
and the company
Sekai Kodomo Zaidan
we call that FGC
Foundation for Global Children
so I'm very thankful for him
1:27:00
ever even taking a chance on me
and proving me
that good kind people
like genuine people
exist because
before that when I was in New York
or even in Bhutan
nobody had proved that to me
I was always very doubtful about
everybody, I was doubting and questioning
everybody's intention but after
I met him I truly believe that there
are people that exist in the world
who are kind
with no secret agenda
with no agenda whatsoever
they're only helping you to help you
and not try to get anything back from you
yeah
and I think it's a beautiful lesson he taught me
because I grew up
my mother always told me
my teachers always told me
my friends always told me, my family always told me
that there is no such thing as free lunch
that if somebody's good to you
you have to like you know there's always
an expectation
but yeah Miyazawa is probably
the first and the only
person that did not expect
anything from me
he was just there to give
I wanted to see him
the saddest part is
he used to always be like
because he was suffering
he was fighting cancer for a very long time
when I met him he had cancer
and he did tell me about his cancer
and it
I really believe because he has a very
he's 72 years old
he had a very childlike energy
like a very youthful energy around him
so I was like oh he's going to
make it you know he has made it this far
he's going to make it and he would always be like
you better study hard
and make sure that you know I get to
see your graduation that I'm alive
for that so he would always be like
make sure you graduate before I die
like you know and
I think it was a bad omen for him to say that
because my graduation was on March
24th and he passed away
on the morning of
23rd so
yeah 24
hours yeah one day
he missed my graduation by one day
and yeah during my graduation
like if you look at my graduation
pictures it's heavily edited
I edited
that picture very much
because my face was
pussy I was crying I was laughing
I didn't know whether to be happy or sad
every time I was happy
I felt guilty because he just passed away
and I'm laughing and it would make
me sad and I would cry but every time I cried
again it would make me feel
like guilty because
you know of course he does not want
to see me cry he wants me to celebrate my
graduation my achievement and accomplishment
but yeah like it was
a very confusing day for me
so all my graduation pictures
are very very heavily edited
with a lot of filters and editing
tools because I looked horrible
if it wasn't for editing
1:30:00
I would look very very horrible
that's why I started to
appreciate people more
and believe in them
it's amazing
yeah
it's not about
how to raise people but
how to show love
you can never learn that
by yourself
it's the same for
good seniors, good bosses
but when you see
real people
I'm so touched
about your story
I'm so touched
about your story
I'm so touched
about your story
yeah
all credits to him
he I think
gave me the most beautiful
gift one can give anybody
any human being
I do want to keep his legacy
in that sense because
my husband and his wife
they don't have kids
they don't have any biological children
of their own
and
I think I would want to keep
his memory alive by making
sure that what he did to me
and what kindness
he showed to me I'm able to show that
to somebody else
this is definitely a dream of mine
I want to be able to say that
I gave
the gift of education because education
is very important for me
because especially
as a woman I think
education is the only thing that people cannot
take away from you
your degree certificates can burn
somebody can steal it
any natural
calamity that falls on us
it can take it away but
the education, the knowledge is there
nobody can take that away from you
whereas if you own a building
if you own a property
if it burns down, you don't have anything
it can be easily taken away from you
but I really believe that
education is the only thing that can never
be taken from you
you will always have it, once you have it
there is no way anybody can
take it away from you
and the fact that he's the one who gave me
that
it makes it more special
and yeah, I would like to
do that for somebody else too
1:33:08
good vibes
good vibes only
it was a really good conversation
it was very touching
I was motivated
I was educated
I learned a lot
Temma
Temma teacher
please
I think that's the only thing
I would also tell other people
if you can give anybody
a gift, you can give the gift
of education and knowledge
and I wanna
I wanna be a wedding planner
in the future for you
that is if I
not when I get married
I wanna be the guest
of your wedding party
yes, you can be my guest of honor
if I get married
I will do my speech
right now
I do not see marriage anywhere
in my future
I won't make it easy
for you to get married
I want you to be happy
with a good person
who?
who?
and I feel like every time
I go to see anybody
it's like 2 hours away
the commuting time
can be saved
I am planning on moving
but not soon
hopefully by next year
I will be able to move
somewhere close to Tokyo
let's keep up with Temma
yes, yes
I will keep in touch with both of you
I believe our listeners
will love your story
there are teachers
with the teary eyes
I hope I didn't make it
I really hope I didn't make your podcast
boring or anything
it was not boring at all
it's like
this is exactly what
we wanna do
educate people and educate ourselves
at the same time
exchange the values
1:36:00
you did it
thank you
thank you
the awkward silence
I haven't
thinking about how to end this
because I was just listening
this is it
anything you wanna say?
please do let me know
whenever you girls are in town
like in Tokyo
even though I live pretty far away
I will make sure I make some time
to come to Tokyo
as well
I would love to keep in touch
I will take you up on
visiting Okinawa soon
I do intend on planning
maybe next year
because this winter I am finally going home
after almost 4 years
I am going back to Bhutan
for the first time
thank you so much
I wish you both the best of luck
with your podcast and radio
I will make sure
I follow you both
thank you so much for having me
I had so much fun
thank you Pema
thank you for coming to our show
bye
bye
bye
