ポッドキャストの紹介
Konnichiwa! I'm your host Mayu for 3AM OTTACK! In this podcast, we talk all about anime, manga,
movies, music, and the history through our distinct perspectives as a born and raised
Japanese known otaku, me, and an American anime fan. That's me! Welcome, welcome!
I'm Mayu, like I introduced myself. Could you introduce about yourself, please?
Sure, my name is Cisco. I'm Mayu's husband. I've been an anime fan since I was 11,
and I'm fluent in Japanese.
Awesome. I'm opposite. I'm a wife of him. And even though I was born and raised in Japan,
I don't really know much about that culture, anime, manga culture. I grew up watching like
Ghibli or some like animes for little kids, but it's a new territory for me. I'm still
exploring and learning from my husband and from our friend who is a manga artist.
And we actually started another podcast called 3AM OTTACK! And we talk about the same topic
as this one, but all in Japanese. So she can't join sometimes, so we decided to
do our own version all in English for non-Japanese speaking audiences.
ゴールデンカムイの概要
And I gotta say, I'm thrilled that we're recording in English because this is just
going to be so much easier for me. It's challenging for me.
Yeah, so now we have 3AM OTTACK! We talk with three people and 2AM for two people,
so it's easy to understand. Okay, now let's get started. Today, we would like to talk about
Golden Kamuy. We both recently watched anime version and we really liked watching and I
really liked the storyline and everything. So before we dive into it, Cisco, could you
read the description? Explanation? What do you call it?
Sure. It's a little bit of a synopsis.
Summary?
Yeah, summary taken straight from Wikipedia. Golden Kamuy is a Japanese manga series written
and illustrated by Satoru Noda. It was serialized in Shueisha's seinen manga magazine Weekly Young
Jump from August 2014 to April 2022, with its chapters collected in 31 tankobon volumes.
The story follows Saeichi Sugimoto, a veteran of the early 20th century Russo-Japanese War,
and his quest to find a huge fortune of gold of the Ainu people,
helped by a young Ainu girl named Ashirupa. The Ainu language in the story is supervised
by Hiroshi Nakagawa, an Ainu language linguist from Chiba University.
文化体験と旅行
Thank you so much.
We've seen up to the end of the third season of the anime and I've been reading the manga and I
think I'm on the sixth tankobon, so I have not gotten very far.
So, yeah. Well, how do you feel about this anime and the manga?
I love it. I've really been excited to read it, both because so much of the information is new to
me, even though I was an East Asian Studies concentrator, I guess is what you would say,
in my college. I feel like I really haven't learned that much about the Ainu people and so
getting to know the culture via this manga has been really cool.
We went on a trip last summer to Hokkaido and did a road trip around the whole island
and saw a bunch of stuff that shows up in Golden Kamuy, so it's been really cool that we got to
experience it firsthand and then read about it later and make all these great connections.
So true, so true. Yeah, we kind of followed the route as Sugimoto and Ashirupa
went on their journey, which was interesting. When we were trying to plan the trip to Hokkaido,
I was not sure about going to Abashiri because it's pretty far, but you really wanted to go
and you really wanted to go see the prison over there. Well, I didn't even know it was there. You
were saying you wanted to go to the Ryusho Museum, the Iceberg Museum,
because you'd been there as a kid. And then when I was trying to figure out how to get there on
Google Maps, I saw that it was basically right next to the Abashiri Prison Museum.
And I guess many, many years ago, we went to the Alcatraz Museum in the Bay Area. And I remember
really liking that museum. It was a really cool experience to go to Alcatraz. And so I think
that's why when I saw the Abashiri Prison Museum, I was like, oh, I bet it's really good. And it was,
they recreated the whole prison. I guess they had a lot of Golden Kamui, I don't know, material or
promo material in the prison. Yeah, at the gift shop and the stuff. Yeah, I think that was part
of what made us decide to watch it, actually. Yeah, yeah. I think, I don't know, I'm from
northern part of Japan, kind of close to Hokkaido. But whenever I hear the word Abashiri, the name
Abashiri, I associate with prison, like immediately, because there was, I've never watched this before,
but there was a movie about the prison. A lot of Japanese people think about
the Abashiri equal the prison. But it's not actually in use anymore, right? Or did they
build a new one somewhere? I think they built a new one. The museum one is like an old one.
アバシリ刑務所の雰囲気
Got it. Yeah, but it was amazing inside. It was kind of beautiful. Yeah, yeah, it was like
a very pretty, at least the place where they held all the prisoners, was sort of like,
had like a very, I don't know, brutal beauty to it. I agree. I mean, it's kind of, it's not like,
you know, metal kind of concrete kind of thing. It's made out of wood. Right. So even though the
place must be freezing in winter, it gives kind of give you like a warm feeling inside of it when
we visited in summer. I definitely feel like it's, it feels warmer than like concrete prisons,
which feel really, really cold. And kind of like, I also just like American prisons are like
intensely dehumanizing places. And I think kind of the rest of the world isn't as like awful to
its prisoners as the United States is. And this, I think if I'm, if I remember it correctly,
the Abashiri prison is based on like a, like a French or a Belgian prison or something.
So like, it doesn't really have that same kind of like, you know, we are here to make you miserable
kind of architecture that American prisoners have. More humane? I mean, it's still a prison.
Like, I don't really want to call it a humane place. And it's definitely designed to try to
prevent escapes and stuff. It just feels like, I don't know, like when you walk through Alcatraz,
like it just feels like it was designed to make people feel awful. And like, the Abashiri prison
doesn't feel like quite as, I don't know, just like evil for lack of a better way to put it.
Right, right. Alcatraz, like it looked kind of scary inside.
Yeah, exactly.
ゴールデンカムイのキャラクター
Yeah. So yeah, at the Abashiri prison, there's a like famous like prisoner who used to escape from
every like prison he went. And that person is, became the model for one of the characters
in Golden Kamei. And he's really funny. I like that. I like the character.
Yeah, I think they've, they've done a good job making Shida Ishii like a comedic relief character
and also, you know, sort of being true to the story of the guy that he's based on in terms of
his ability to get out of different places.
Right. So who's else like, who's your favorite character in Golden Kamei?
I mean, I definitely like Sugimoto a lot, just because he's like such a badass. But
I found myself really liking Ogata, who is like a bad guy, more or less. But I think especially
in the anime, like, his voice is so cool that like, I sort of can't help like rooting for him,
even though, well, and he's like, and he's just like, so talented. Like, he's such a good sniper
that like, he also gives off like a very like cool vibe. And so I like both of those characters a lot.
Okay. I personally like Tanigaki, because I'm from Akita Prefecture in Japan,
which gets really cold in winter. And Tanigaki is from Akita. And he's like called Matagi,
who's like a bear hunter in Akita. So I really like the character and his side story that there
was like a one entire episode about his past, which was like, shocking and like moving. And
I'm like, surprising. Like it was like, so perfect. I just wanted to see more of it.
I feel like you got to root for like the hometown boy, right? Like, I'm biased. Yes. Yeah. I mean,
Tanigaki is cool. I like him too. But I feel like the fact that you know, some actual bear hunters
in real life also like made you like a little bit more of like his supporter.
That's true. I yeah, I know one bear hunter, like my friend got married to a bear hunter, who's a
hair, what do you call barber? Yeah, he's a barber. Yeah, you're right.
He's a barber. But like when he when it's needed, he goes to goes in the mountain and then hunt
bears with other folks. Which is cool. And he told me about how the like a gun regulations in Japan
is really, really strict. Yeah, it was really fascinating. And it must be. I don't know,
maybe he used to it or something, but it must be terrifying to you that you have to face
bears and then like kind of basically fight it. I think it must be like a lot scarier to face
bears in like the timeframe of Golden Kamuy where like, your gun only has like five bullets. And
like, it's not doesn't even have that much stopping power. Like, I'm sure it's terrifying
to hunt bears in the modern day also. But like, the kinds of guns that we have now,
like just feel like, probably like you have a better chance of surviving an encounter with a
bear, like a lot better chance nowadays than like you used to. Right, right. And in Golden Kamuy, so
there's a like a one of the main characters name is Ashiripa. And she's from Ainu village. And
they in the anime, they explain a lot about like culture, Ainu culture, and they
see a lot of things as Kamuy, God. Yeah. And I like the aspect of like, they like explaining
日本の歴史の再考
to audiences, I think like mainly Japanese people at the beginning about their own culture that we
didn't really learn at school. Right? Well, I mean, I just remember being surprised that Kamuy
was God, like that that was the word for God. And because I was like, Oh, it's like almost
exactly the same as the regular Japanese word for God, Kamuy. Like, clearly, those things are
related, right? It's not like, you know, that came out of nowhere. And so I, I don't know,
I think like, Japanese, like, understand, like Japanese people's understanding of their own
history, to me is always really interesting. Because there's like, kind of this like big
unwillingness to admit that like modern day Japanese people came from Korea,
even though like modern Japanese language is like, totally related to Korean. And then like, there's
also this sort of like unwillingness to admit that like the Ainu people like existed in most of or
all of the islands of Japan, like before the newer Korean arrivals, like push them out.
And like that part of history isn't emphasized in like, any of the like Japanese texts I used
to study Japanese history. And I think like, there's a lot of parallels with the way that
Americans don't learn about Native Americans, or, you know, at least, like Native Americans sort of
didn't appear very much in American history textbooks until like the 1990s or so. And so
it feels like Japan is still kind of far behind in like educating its own people about like the
Ainu as people. And like, if you were to watch like, I don't know, like a Western today, like
you might see the way Native Americans are portrayed in like American cinema and be like,
oh, we've like come like a really long way in terms of like, both educating people about like,
what Native American life was like outside of things like movies, and like, having depictions
of Native Americans in ways that are like, I don't know, equitable, and like, realistic, and
I don't know, like fair. Whereas like, again, like this being the first time I've ever seen
Ainu people like depicted, I guess maybe, maybe you could argue Princess Mononoke had some like,
I don't know, if not Ainu, then at least like Izo people in it. But like, it's, I think it's great
that like, they there's so much to be learned from the show. And at the same time, it's sort of like,
highlights how little most Japanese people learn about like, the indigenous people of the
islands of Japan. Yeah, I wish I learned more about it. But like, I don't know, like, I didn't
really try to study by myself. But like, in this trip, we made it to into Hokkaido,
we learned a little bit about the culture. And by watching this anime, I learned a lot about
the culture too. And I'm like, there's like funny things about like, little kids get like a special
names when they were young, so that evil spirits don't come or like, you know, give sickness or
anything. So like Ashiripa, right? Her name is like grandpa's butthole. Is that right?
Yeah, I think I think you're right that that's the that was her original name. And I was gonna
say actually, that's like not, I think coming up with the names that are sort of like dirty things
is it seems pretty unique to the Ainu. But like, there are a lot of cultures that don't name kids
until they're older, because they're afraid like, if you give them a name, they'll die like too
young. I think I remember like being a little kid and reading like a book about Japanese culture
that said, like, Japanese parents tend not to scold kids really hard until they're like five
to seven. And that like, really? Yeah, I mean, I don't know that this is true in your lifetime. I
think this was like, true, like, Nope, a long time ago. Well, and, and your family, but like,
I supposedly there were like times where like, before starting school, basically, like Japanese
parents were pretty indulgent towards children for a similar reason of like, high child mortality
and like not wanting like to like, essentially scare their spirits back away. But I think that's
like a that's like a common practice in like, societies where child mortality is a thing is like,
different ways of trying to like not either attack yourself too hard to kids that might die anyway,
or like, or like a rite of passage of like, congratulations, you survived early childhood.
Like, now we will take you seriously or give you a real name. But yeah, I think it's funny that like
the Ainu in particular, give them like names of things that are gross, so that the evil spirits
like won't want to get near them. Yeah, it's a very like a unique idea. Okay, so I want to talk
about the food they eat. Because they because they hunt so much. They eat like squirrels,
料理と食文化の探求
they eat bears, they like deers, and fish as well. Yep. Yeah, they're like a lot of scenes of like
cooking, which I kind of enjoy. Yeah, I came to this manga not that long after reading Shokugeki
no Soma. So that were food wars. So I feel like I also appreciated the emphasis on food.
Although, I can really relate to Sugimoto not wanting to try some of the delicacies that
Ashiripa offers him. Like, she keeps trying to make him eat eyeballs and brains,
both of which are things I would also struggle with wanting to put in my mouth.
I don't know. Yeah, I don't I don't think I would be scared to eating
those things too. But other parts maybe. Yeah, that some of the other stuff seems okay.
I'm, I'm personally vegetarian. But, but I might, I might try if I hunt by myself. And if the
there are too many of whatever was hurting ecosystem or something, I might I don't know.
But yeah, like, and then like, you know, that miso miso paste is seems like a such a big like
condiment in the show. Well, I think it's, you know, it was a big deal for
the Japanese troops in the army, right? It's a preserved food. So you can like carry it with
you and like add it to kind of anything in order to make it taste better. And it seems like one of
the big plot points of the show, not plot points, but one of the big things in the show is that
the I knew clearly don't have me so and so find it to be like rare and sort of a novelty.
Hmm, yeah. And then like I said, if it calls it also mouth, which means like poop,
because it looks like poop. I mean, it does. It does. Yeah, it does.
Yeah, there's no she's, she's right. This is great. I love me. So yeah, I like it too.
Okay, so, all right. So I would like to, like, you know, teach a word in Japanese
for each episode. Yeah. So I, I don't know, like, do you have any suggestion today?
I, I think the I mean, there's, I guess we're not going to do like a lot more golden Kamui
episodes. But I think the one that sums it up for me is Fujimi.
Immortal, because it's what Sugimoto keeps screaming whenever he gets like a wound that
would kill most other people. But he says, you know, what do you mean? Oh, Sugimoto da.
And so for Jimmy, meaning like, not what not death body, right?
Uh huh. Yes. I might. Is that right? Those are the right characters?
Yeah, yeah. And so Fujimi, immortal, is like, is my pick since we're, we're going with immortal
Sugimoto. Wait, wait, wait, how, how does he say that? The phrase in English?
I think I've only actually because we watched it in Japanese subtitled. I don't know.
You read it. Yeah, I think he says, I'm immortal, or I'm the immortal,
so. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So Fujimi, I don't know if I, if you ever have a chance to use it.
Well, if anyone ever stabs you, and you decide to like, keep fighting them anyway,
you should terrify them by screaming. And then like, like, attack them. That's definitely I
think it would work. That is scared of the person. Why are you speaking Japanese? What the hell is
going on? For sure. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Well, anything else you would like to add?
I'll put one more word of the day just because it's the one that I feel like we got the most
out of in terms of it being an Ainu word. And that is Hina Hina, which means delicious or,
you know, tasty. And I feel like in Japan, lots of foreigners going to Japan will remember,
you know, either umai or oishi, because everybody's got to eat. And so much of the
food in Japan is really tasty. So I think Hina Hina is a good word to remember if you
ever happen to be in like an Ainu village in Hokkaido, and you're eating something
like squirrel brains. Okay, thank you so much. All right. So our first episode went pretty well,
I think. Sure. Yeah. So I hope we'll keep doing this whenever our other partner couldn't
make it to the recording. So hope to do that again. All right. Thank you so much for listening
to this week's episode. Don't forget to subscribe and follow 2am ATT&CK and 3am ATT&CK on Spotify,
Apple Podcasts and on YouTube. It means so much to us and we'll keep making fun episodes.
See you next time at more 2am ATT&CK. All right. Okay.
