00:01
Welcome to 英語で雑談！Kevin！s English Room Podcast.
Hello.
Yeah, so the quote that you did from the video.
The last one, yeah.
The Trevor Mishimasa.
Not by him, but I think the conversation he had with somebody.
That just said, you know, they got that level of friendship.
Yeah.
And what brought friendship to that level was not only like you can call somebody if you're in deep trouble,
but you can call something very happy happens to you, then you can share that to that guy or not.
Is that the fact that bring their friendship to that level, right?
And that's something stuck in your mind, right?
Yeah, it was. Yeah, yeah, sure.
And that's stuck in me now.
Okay.
Yeah.
Okay.
Right.
What is it about this phrase that's stuck in you?
Because that's what I'm feeling recently for one or two years.
Okay.
Like, so every time, so a few episodes ago, I said, like, to build your friendship,
you talk about your dreams, your secrets, your worries.
Yeah.
And be vulnerable is very key, right?
Yeah.
And not only those like a nayami side, but like sharing what you achieved or like what you happy about.
What you're happy about, yeah.
Yeah.
It's also very, to me, like recently, if I could share that with somebody,
makes me feel more like I'm safe, I would say.
Okay.
Is what I'm feeling.
Okay.
I don't, that's not very intuitive to me.
Okay.
How, what do you, how is the logic behind you feeling safe when you share with people your happiness?
Yeah.
Like, something you achieved is something that you want, right?
Yes.
And that could be something somebody else want to achieve too.
Yes.
Ah, I see.
So it's like, if I say that, that I achieved this, and of course some people would be jealous of it.
Yeah.
Or for example, for example, like we're both, for example, singer, singer,
and we both have a dream of having a live concert.
03:04
Yeah.
Packed of people.
Yeah.
Successful life.
We both have that same dream and doing our everyday thing and try hard.
And then one achieved.
Yes.
And one failed, for example.
Yeah.
And then if the successor, like say that to your friend who failed, and then even I failed,
if I can share that happiness with him, or, ah, I failed and jealous of you,
that's the possibility, right?
Yeah.
So that's why kind of, I sometimes become afraid of saying so.
And if the other guy will be very happy, from the bottom of his heart, and saying that and share that,
if we could share that happiness with him, I feel like we're not kind of competing each other.
Yeah.
It's like we're helping each other to achieve our, both of our dreams.
Yeah.
And that makes me, I guess, like safe from that conversation.
I see.
Yeah.
And to me, that's very big recently.
You're talking about, can I share my success without worrying about making the other person
uncomfortable or making the other person feel jealous?
Is, did I phrase that correctly?
Um, yeah.
Can you say that again?
Yeah.
So you feel safe when you can share your happiness without worrying about,
ooh, is he jealous if I tell him that?
Like, ooh, is it going to sound like a brag if I tell him that?
Did I phrase that correctly?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Hmm.
But I think I would feel that way in very small amount, in any case.
Like in any relationship.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, but what I feel safe from is the fact that the receiver looked or sounded very happy about it.
Okay.
So you use the word looked or sounded.
So what if the other person, the receiver of the information was like actually deep down jealous?
Yeah.
Ooh, I wanted that position too, but was like, hey, I'm so happy for you.
Yeah.
Is that not a worry for you?
That's a worry.
Yeah.
06:00
But at least the, he's trying to, to help me.
That's one good thing.
Like he's taking the, he took the position of.
Yeah.
Being a supporter.
Yeah.
Right.
Like not, okay.
Yeah.
Aside from what's actually in his mind.
Right, right, right.
He took the decision to be a supporter.
Yeah.
Yeah.
He's trying to.
Yes.
Yes.
Because the jealous, so the second one.
Yeah.
Like a jealous is something very natural feeling that you can't actually stop it.
It's just happening.
Then just, it's happening.
So I'm not blaming about that, but, but, you know, trying to ignore that and
trying to help me is one.
And also if, if it's possible, if that guy would say that I'm kind of slightly still jealous of it.
You know, to be like being honest and then like, well, it's slightly jealous.
Cause I did it, but I would support you and I'm happy about it.
Would be like, I guess like the safest.
You feel the safest.
Safest conversation.
Does that not going to prevent you from sharing the same news in the future?
Like, so let's say you talk to me, let's say I want to be a musician.
And you told me that, Hey, I just did a one-man concerto.
And I was like, I wanted to do that.
Right.
Deep down.
I was like, Hey, I'm so happy for you.
But honestly, like, I am kind of jealous of you, man.
But you know, but it's our own life.
Hey, let's, let's, let's embrace each other's, you know, difficulties and success.
And, and I, and I love you for that.
And, um, and let's say I communicated in that style.
Okay.
Is that going to prevent you from, let's say you did a, you accomplished something bigger
in your musician life.
Yeah.
Are you going to say that to me again?
If, is it going to stop you from doing it?
So it's very depends on the voice and how, and what is your actual mind.
Okay.
That bring those words from you.
So it's very depends on the conversation.
But if, if that's what you said.
Okay.
After I share the happiness to you, then I may not be saying that to you.
Maybe.
Then I don't, okay.
Then how is that you feeling safe though?
Because, um, so that conversation wasn't very safe to me, first of all.
Oh, okay.
Okay.
Because like you weren't, so I felt that, Oh, he's not actually support.
Like I'm feeling happy about this.
Okay.
So, but at least you're trying to be, so I feel, thank you.
And I feel at least like some safeness.
Okay.
The first step.
So that's it.
Okay.
So, okay, well, let me do you, right.
09:01
And you tell me you respond in a way.
Okay.
That you think makes you safe.
Wow.
Right.
I can do that.
Okay.
Because I have no idea.
I mean, if it's real to you, then I can maybe do that.
Okay.
I don't like those simulations.
And I see.
And I, you can't act it out.
Yeah.
It's not something you can do that.
I see.
It's unnatural.
I see.
If I do that, it's not.
You'd already.
Yeah.
Already.
I don't feel it.
Lying to your feelings.
And it's not, you can't do it.
I mean, I can try though.
But I don't like trust myself.
What will be some of the elements?
Like, for example.
Elements.
Like a maybe face, like tone sounds worse.
If you can believe it or not.
Is that true?
If you can believe that the responder is actually accepting your success or not.
Yeah.
When you looked at my response, how I acted out, you didn't believe that I actually accepted
your success.
That's why you didn't feel safe.
Yeah.
I see.
Like the amount of, yeah, it's many elements, you know.
Yeah.
Like how one can spot a lie, you know.
Kind of.
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So, but at least if one was acting like that, then I would be thankful for him at least.
Because he tries to be, you know, nice to me, tries to share the happiness that I have.
So, that's one step.
I see.
And I feel a certain level of safeness.
Because, yeah, yeah.
But it's true.
It's kind of kake for me.
Okay, maybe he can, I can trust him.
And like a friendship build.
Oh, maybe I can trust him.
I can say that I can share my happiness.
And then say that.
And what if we failed?
Right.
And then maybe I'm gonna go, like, keep distance a little bit.
So, it's true.
It's kind of kake.
Yeah.
Right, right.
Okay.
So, that's what I, so if it's successfully done, I'll feel so safe, so happy.
More than, like, I share worries about my life and share that feeling.
But more than that, like, if I could share happy, happily, then I feel more safe than that one.
So, that's why the quotation that you did is stuck in me differently.
12:01
I see.
Yeah.
Here's another angle.
Okay, okay.
So, the friend that I was talking about, that I was talking about friendship with,
we kind of led into the same path of conversation, like what we're having right now.
Yeah.
One of the conclusions that he came up with that I didn't really agree on.
Okay.
Was, he was like, okay, so if that's the case, if sharing happiness is one of the factors of
building a great relationship, maybe finding a friend who doesn't match interest is a good idea.
Yeah, yeah.
Maybe finding a friend who's in a completely different field of interest,
who's in a completely different line of work.
Yeah.
I am a YouTuber, I'm a content creator right now.
That person was not doing content creation.
He did a little bit of content creation, but like, he's Kaixian right now, right?
He's not really into gaining subscribers or he's not looking to, you know, being a free,
free, I don't know, Jiege or something like that.
So, we really don't have that much, like.
Yeah.
We don't have a conflict of, like.
You know, in the same.
Yeah, he thought it was a good idea to find a friend.
Like, so if you're in this journey of finding a good friend that you can go
to a vacation with in your 60s, maybe it's great to find somebody who,
to look for people in a completely different field.
Okay.
It was his claim.
Okay.
And what I disagreed on was that maybe that friendship is not friendship.
Maybe real friendship is, even if that person's in the same field.
Yeah.
Someone who can accept that fact that he, that I accomplished what he couldn't do.
Being able to overcome that feeling because he valued friendship over.
Yeah.
Grieve or like jealousy.
Yeah.
That's what I thought of bigger friendship is, I thought, was what I concluded.
What do you think about that?
Well, yeah, I agree.
I agree with both, actually.
Yeah, yeah.
So, first of all, I agree with you.
Yeah.
That you overcome those jealous and competitive, like, minds.
Yeah.
And you put friendship over those.
Yeah.
Is the biggest friendship.
Like, true friendship, if you want to say.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, that's why, if that guy having a slight jealousness, but putting friendship over that.
Yeah.
And share and cheer me up.
Yeah.
Makes me the safest.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, I agree with that.
And, yeah.
So, that's the deepest friendship, I think.
So, you agree that it's deeper.
Yeah.
Than finding a friend.
Yeah.
In a different category.
Yeah, yeah.
15:00
But to me, like, finding friends from different world is kind of less difficult.
Like, less possibility of making a conflict.
Okay.
So, if that doesn't happen to you and your friends, naturally, you don't have to make it.
Because there's nothing happened.
So, you can actually make it, right?
So, could be a good idea.
Yeah.
You think it's, like, strategically a good idea.
Yeah, yeah.
If you, right, if you are the chooser.
Yeah.
And you can pick anybody, like, you want.
Yeah.
That could be a good idea.
Yeah.
Yeah, like, potentially.
Right, right, right.
You know.
Yeah, one of the arguments he made against me, my idea, was that, okay, to find somebody
who is able to, that I agreed on, who is able to overcome that jealousy and choose friendship,
is someone who's actually very happy with their life.
Like, someone who's mature enough, who's happy, who doesn't feel that much jealousy.
And that itself is so hard to do.
Yeah.
That is, like, finding someone who is happy on their own, I thought was so much harder to find.
Yeah.
So, that was, that's one of the problems with my idea, though.
It's true, it's true, it's true.
Finding someone who can value the friendship over, like, not, who someone,
finding someone who won't feel jealousy, who won't feel jealous if I succeeded in something
that they wanted.
Yeah, true.
It's very difficult.
Yeah.
Because jealousy is, you know, it's a natural feeling, though.
Yeah.
So, yeah, just like you said, if we overcome the jealousness together,
then that makes friendship, like, deepest, maybe.
Right, right, right, yeah, yeah.
That's not, so I don't agree with his opinion.
The part that I don't agree with his opinion is,
friendship is not something you, like, pick a guy, like, watching those elements and then...
Oh, I see, I see.
...choose it.
It's not something like that to me.
Yeah.
It's more, maybe for one time, we had a conversation and then I felt his jealous over the friendship.
And then I felt a little bit sad.
That happened once before, but, like, maybe a few years later and do things together.
And then a few years later, someday we overcome that.
And that's, like, the deepest...
I see.
...form of, like, with a story.
Okay, so you're talking about, did it happen naturally or not?
18:04
Like, did it occur naturally or not?
Yeah, or if we tried or not.
Okay.
Yeah, it's like, I think there's not, like, perfect match or imperfect match for the friendship.
It's just you or you both tried hard to...
Be friends.
Yeah, each other or not.
Yeah.
But that's deep, though.
I think that's deep.
That's deep, though.
Yeah.
But it's difficult because some of them are very difficult to become friends.
Some of them are very easy to become friends.
And I personally, like, easily tend to spend time with them.
Yeah, yeah.
So, yeah.
But, yeah.
Yeah, so that's one element that I don't agree with that.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Right.
But, yeah.
Right.
But the thing is that the reason why I started this conversation,
started talking about this topic is every time I say this,
I, for example, like, I had good things happen to me.
And you shared that happiness with me, right?
So, that was very...
That has been very big to me.
And every time you did that, I felt, oh, friendship.
Is here.
I feel friendship in you.
So, thank you.
That's what I wanted to say.
That's why I wanted to...
I felt the same feeling of they had a conversation, I guess.
Like, it's one step deeper than...
I see.
Like, you can call to help him or like those, share the happiness.
Yeah, I see, I see.
So, that's why I wanted to...
Well, thank you for...
I brought that conversation.
Thank you for saying that.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I really...
Shake of hands.
Yeah.
All right.
That's true.
All right.
Kiss maybe?
That's one...
I don't know about kiss though.
I'm not sure about kissing though.
I'm still not there yet.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I felt great with the handshake.
Yeah.
That was great.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's still...
Still, it was a hand-to-hand contact.
Yeah.
Not a cheek-on-cheek.
Yeah.
But still though.
Right, right, right.
That was a friendship moment.
True.
Feel very...
Like a warm...
Energy and warm, right?
Yeah, true, true.
Positive energy there.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I love that.
That's great.
Yeah.
Well, thank you for telling me that.
No, I mean, yeah.
That's what I...
Because that's been...
You know, one of the biggest theme too.
You know, friendship and...
You know, life.
Yeah, yeah.
So...
Right.
Yeah, actually I've been very...
21:01
I had been afraid of telling my personal dreams
and personal things that I achieved and things.
Yeah.
To anybody, actually.
Yeah.
But yeah.
You know, that had been my kind of biggest worry in my life.
Oh, I see.
Oh.
So...
Well, thank you for telling me that, man.
Thank you for telling me that.
I...
Yeah.
I mean, I...
Every time you...
You know, we've talked about life shit.
Ever since we were, I guess, shukatsu?
Yeah.
Beginning of shukatsu, did we talk...
I don't know if we talked about it, but...
Was that?
But...
Yeah, but I remember when I was in...
When we were in college, talked about that.
Yeah.
I definitely remember us being in T-Site.
Yes.
I remember.
Outside, talking about...
Yes.
The movie.
Yeah, we were gonna...
They were gonna make a movie about us, right?
How we're successful and shit.
We're gonna be like...
I don't know, like Mark Zuckerberg or something like that.
And we're gonna have a movie about us, right?
Yes.
Yes.
And I know how much you care about working on your passion
and taking care of your life.
So I'm happy to hear that.
Oh, yeah.
You're like working on your craft.
Thank you.
That you got to work on music that you love,
that you're like enjoying life.
That is something that I love hearing from you, man.
Yeah, well, thank you.
Thank you.
All right.
All right.
Good moment.
Good moment, yeah.
I do feel it.
Yeah.
Thank you.
Right, yeah.
Let's be friends until we die, man.
Yeah, that's lovely.
Let's go on vacations in 80.
Yeah.
All right.
Great episode.
Great.
Great, great episode there.
True.
All right.
It doesn't usually happen in podcast shows.
Yeah.
All right.
So thanks for listening, guys.
Thank you.
Thank you to you, man.
Thank you to you, man.
Well, I mean, thank you for running this show, man.
Oh, yeah, no problem.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Thank you.
That's why I love this show, by the way.
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
All right.
Thanks for listening, guys.
Thank you.
Bye-bye.